Present:
Dak
Keeper
Lita
snowrose
flicka
Dak 19:36:13 pm CST
if any has a topic whisper to Me and I will open the forum , do we have a scribe ?
snowrose{JTr}'s pleasure~GS~fg 19:40:26 pm CST
snowrose will scribe Master Dak
Dak 19:42:33 pm CST
ok, I have a topic, I will open the forum, same rules, keep greetings and chit chat to whispers, for the benefit of the scribe, *smile*
Today's Topic
Babies? Toddlers? Teens?
Quotes For This Week
Pregnancy is one of the most role-played events within our Gorean world, perhaps second only to companionships and events of battle and/or war. It seems a natural conclusion to the companionship of Free Man and Woman, and rarely, between Master and slave, and even more rare, slave with slave.
- from freewebs.com/rpcog/pregnancyguidelinesplus.htm
"The selling of infant daughters is nor that unusual in large cities. Some women do it regularly. They make a practice of it, much as they might sell their hair to hair merchants or to the weavers of catapult ropes. Some women, it is rumored, hope for daughters, that they may sell to the slave trade. These women, in effect breed slaves. Too, there is a common belief for which there is much evidence, incidentally, and in the light of this belief some families would rather sell a daughter than raise her. Too, of course, daughters, unlike sons, are seldom economic assets to the family. Indeed they cannot even pass on the gens name. They can retain it in companionship, if they wish, if suitable contractual arrangements are secured, but they cannot pass it on. The survival of the name and the continuance of the patrilineal line are important to many Goreans."
- Mercenaries of Gor, page 302- 303
"The caste structure," said my father patiently, with perhaps the trace of a smile on his face, "is relatively immobile, but not frozen, and depends on more than birth. For example, if a child in his schooling shows that he can raise caste, as the expression is, he is permitted to do so. But, similarly, if a child does not show the aptitude expected of his caste, whether it be, say, that of physician or warrior, he is lowered in caste."
- Tarnsman of Gor Book 1 Page 42
To determine whether or not a female character is pregnant, two issues must be considered and resolved. The first and most obvious is that she must have engaged in sexual relations with a male. There are those who wish to bring such practices as artificial insemination to the Gorean game, and as of the date that these guidelines were written, the only suggestion of artificial insemination was in the City of Tharna when ruled by the Tatrix:
"I have never been in the arms of a man before, she said, for the men of Tharna may not touch women. I must have looked puzzled. The Caste of Physicians, she said, under the direction of the High Council of Tharna, arranges these matters." (Outlaw of Gor pg 106)
- from freewebs.com/rpcog/pregnancyguidelinesplus.htm
"A woman now descended from the wagon, carrying a small object. She came near to the fire and Genserix motioned for her to put the object down, to lay it on the dirt before him, between himself and the fire. She did so. He then crouched down near it, and gently, with his large hands, put back the edges of the blanket in which it was wrapped. The tiny baby, not minutes old, with tiny gasps and coughs, still startled and distressed with the sharp, frightful novelty of breathing air, never again to return to the shelter of its mother's body, lost in a chaos of sensation, its eyes not focused, unable scarcely to turn its head from side to side, lay before him. The cord had been cut and tied at its belly. Its tiny legs and arms moved. The blood, the membranes and fluids, had been wiped from its small, hot, red, firm body. Then it had been rubbed with animal fat. How tiny were its head and fingers. How startling and wonderful it seemed that such a thing should be alive. Genserix looked at it for a time, and then he turned it over, and examined it further. Then he put it again on its back. He then stood up, and looked down upon it........(cont.)
snowrose{JTr}'s pleasure~GS~fg 19:46:31 pm CST
snow has been here over 5 years and has never seen any of those things happen...she wishes there could be raids
Dak 19:44:02 pm CST
pt 2
...The warriors about the fire, and the woman, and two other women, too, who had now come from the wagon, looked at him. Then Genserix reached down and lifted up the child. The women cried out with pleasure and the men grunted with approval. Genserix held the child up now, happily, it almost lost in his large hands, and then he lifted it up high over his head. "Ho!" called the warriors, standing up, rejoicing. The women beamed.
"It is a son!" cried one of the women.
"Yes," said Genserix. "It is a son!"
"Ho!" called the warriors. "Ho!"
"What is going on?" asked Feiqa.
"The child has been examined," I said. "It has been found sound. It will be permitted to live. It is now an Alar. Too, he has lifted the child up. In this he acknowledges it as his own."
Genserix then handed the child to one of the warriors. He then drew his knife."
~ pg 45-47 Mercenaries of Gor
Questions
1)Have you ever played a parent on Gor and if so how did you work that play?
2) How do you think the regeneration of Gor should be handled in Gorean rp?
3) We do lots of pregnancy in our rp but very little kids, why?
4)What do you feel is the "youngest" age a player should play and why? 2
snowrose{JTr}'s pleasure~GS~fg 19:46:31 pm CST
snow has been here over 5 years and has never seen any of those things happen...she wishes there could be raids
Lita, Physician 19:49:57 pm CST
I think one reason, snow, is that like most sites, we do not allow role-playing of a character younger than 18, for legal reasons. However I see no reason pregnancies or mention of children in the course of role-play might not be allowed.
That's how they did it in the books.
Keeper of flicka 19:50:14 pm CST
I think there is more than one Role Player who comes to Gor to get away from the knee-high barbarians (Read: Kids) so it doesn't make much sense to create them in this milieu.
flicka-slave of Keeper 19:50:30 pm CST
In all of the time in which flicka has been in Gorean chat rooms, 16 years with a long hiatus in the middle ~winks at Jarl Keeper~ never once has she seen a pregnancy, slave pregnancies are very rare in the books, and as Free Companionship is also quite rare in online Gor, flicka feels it would take quite a synchronicity for there to be a pregnancy, it could happen of course.
Keeper of flicka 19:50:54 pm CST
I agree with Lita.
Last question first.
For Me it is simple 18.
snowrose{JTr}'s pleasure~GS~fg 19:51:46 pm CST
~nods to Mistress~ she doesn't think children would add anything to the roleplay...nor pregnancy, since the child couldn't be a character.
Dak 19:53:18 pm CST
we recently had a one of the slaves give birth RT, *smiles*
Ramses 19:53:35 pm CST
*sits back and listens
flicka-slave of Keeper 19:54:21 pm CST
Master Dak, flicka is sure that many of the slaves have given birth real time and also quite a few Free Women.
Keeper of flicka 19:54:22 pm CST
We are a tavern, I would imagine in Gor as on Urth not to many little tackers visit taverns.
Dak 19:54:31 pm CST
I sincerely doubt they would fit in in a place like Port Kar, *smiles*
Lita, Physician 19:55:00 pm CST
I would agree with the age limit, Keeper
Keeper of flicka 19:55:01 pm CST
Yes flicka, some are even Grand-parents!
Dak 19:55:10 pm CST
quite possibly so, *smiles*
Lita, Physician 19:55:24 pm CST
That is true also, Dak.
flicka-slave of Keeper 19:57:09 pm CST
~laughing flicka places a delicate finger across her beloved Jarl's lips~
Shhh, my Jarl on Gor we are all young and nubile.
Keeper of flicka 19:58:01 pm CST
~Running My hands through My salt and pepper hair.~
Indeed flicka, indeed
Lita, Physician 19:58:23 pm CST
Well now snow, I as a Physician, had to bear two children in order to practice My Caste, so I have on occasion in role-play, had to mention that yes, I had borne my required two children and that my family and My former Comp[anion's family had taken them to raise, so that We could practice Our Caste-work unimpaired.
Dak 19:58:45 pm CST
not necessarily without age, tho, flicka, the body doesn't age, but the mind does, *smiles*
Lita, Physician 20:00:23 pm CST
But there are limits even to the aging of the mind, Dak. I know of no instances of senility or alzheimer's on Gor.
flicka-slave of Keeper 20:00:43 pm CST
Hmmm Master Dak, that is a nice way of putting it. While flicka does not hanker for the crass naivety of a 20 year old she does at times long for the flexible body and the stamina that goes with it.
Keeper of flicka 20:02:09 pm CST
Age is a state of mind, not a chronological number, still feel thirty-ish, unless I'm with flicka then I feel...younger.
Dak 20:02:57 pm CST
I think in Gor like animals the old just go off alone and die, *smiles* if they live long enough, many of the men die in battles !
snowrose{JTr}'s pleasure~GS~fg 20:04:17 pm CST
hmmm, when does that crass naivete turm to refinement flicka...surely by 23?
Lita, Physician 20:04:26 pm CST
But Dak, if their bodies do not age, and due to the Stabilization Serums, they do not, then what need to die unless killed accidentally or in battle or murdered.
flicka-slave of Keeper 20:05:11 pm CST
~laughing~ oh indubitably mistress snowrose, 23 is the magical number.
Dak 20:05:14 pm CST
that is probably how they go, *smiles*
Dak 20:06:30 pm CST
it s possible, that not all get the stabilization serum, too !
Keeper of flicka 20:07:12 pm CST
Life changes you snowrose.
Sometimes for the better, sometimes for worse.
If you're lucky you simply learn.
Michelangelo de Buonarroti said in his eighties, 84 I think.
"I am still leaning."
snowrose{JTr}'s pleasure~GS~fg 20:07:15 pm CST
have we read of anyone dying of old age?
Dak 20:07:24 pm CST
I kinda thought, that was mostly for slaves, to keep them young and vital !
Keeper of flicka 20:07:39 pm CST
*Learning Damn it
Learning.
I am still learning to spell!
Kazar~infamous pirate 20:08:07 pm CST
Keeper grins ``` yep y motherin law called me Peter Pan never grew up age is a state of mind am still young
Lita, Physician 20:08:24 pm CST
Dak I have not seen one instance in the books where it mentions that someone did not get the Stabilizaation Serums, nor any mention of anyone being old, or dieing of old age. And few deaths due to diseases, except for Dar Kosis and Bazi Plague
snowrose{JTr}'s pleasure~GS~fg 20:08:35 pm CST
yes she believes that Jarl..to always keep on learning
Dak 20:08:39 pm CST
He probably was leaning, *laughing*
flicka-slave of Keeper 20:08:57 pm CST
Jarl was He leaning when He was hanging from the ceiling of The Sistine Chapel?
Dak 20:10:11 pm CST
but what is the time frame of the books, I think it is only something like 20 years, *smiles*
flicka-slave of Keeper 20:10:20 pm CST
Maybe that is why there are so few births? If few die, then quickly Gor would become over populated.
Dak 20:10:54 pm CST
but there were always battles !
Keeper of flicka 20:11:28 pm CST
Yes flicka, Michelangelo de Buonarroti was learning the gentle art of blinking. He was learning to close his eyes before the paint dripped into them
Dak 20:13:40 pm CST
well, the demand for slaves was so great they had to bring many from earth, so quite possibly so !
Lita, Physician 20:15:06 pm CST
Ubar Luther says, "
The zenith of Gorean medicine has to be the Stabilization Serums. This Serum is a life extending treatment. It was developed some five hundred years ago by the Physician's Castes of Koroba and Ar and transmitted to other Physicians at the Sardar Fairs. Aging was seen as a disease, not an inevitable fate. Centuries of research went into seeking a cure for aging. Unfortunately, this also meant that research into cures for other diseases was ignored. Many people, who were susceptible to those diseases, died during that time. As it was only the resistant that survived, this did tend to strengthen stock. Some diseases died out and others would be later cured once the Stabilization Serums were created. The effect of the Serums is an eventual, gradual transformation of certain genetic structures, resulting in indefinite cell replacement without pattern deterioration. It affects all people differently and on some rare occasions doesn't work. In some rare people, it wears off after only a few hundred years and sometimes it even hastens aging. It is also capable of being transmitted to offspring. The initial Serums were crude but they have been carefully refined over the years. The Priest-Kings possess better Serums but they are for their use only. Goreans consider it the right of all people, free and slave, barbarian or civilized, to have the Serums. They do not deny the Serums to anyone. The Serums are given in a series of four shots, one shot a day for four days in a row. They are injected into the small of the back, over the left hip. On the fifth day, they can take a sample from you to ensure that the Serums have taken hold. Matthew Cabot is the only known person in the books to benefit from the Serums. He came to Gor over 600 years ago. "
Kazar~infamous pirate 20:17:49 pm CST
Dak maybe thats why took women from earth `~` `
books dont talk much about training young ones for war ~
snowrose{JTr}'s pleasure~GS~fg 20:18:03 pm CST
So did He go back and live on Earth to be Tarl's father?
Lita, Physician 20:19:05 pm CST
Snow, I believe He went to Gor after Tarl was born.
snowrose{JTr}'s pleasure~GS~fg 20:20:51 pm CST
~confused~ does that mean that Tarl has been on Gor for hundreds of years too then?
Dak 20:21:25 pm CST
I thought, Matthew Cabot was on an acquisition trip when He impregnated Tarl's mother
Lita, Physician 20:23:04 pm CST
Ubar Luther says Matthew Cabot vanished before Tarl was 6 years old.
Kazar~infamous pirate 20:24:45 pm CST
She was over two million years old though she died during the events of .... His father, Matthew Cabot, would vanish before Tarl Cabot was six years old
Lita, Physician 20:28:37 pm CST
snow, here is a link to Luther's History of Gor gor-now.net/delphius2002/id89.htm He says the time span actually covered in the books is about 50 years, though things that happened before Tarl was first brought to Gor are mentioned. And at one point Tarl was returned to Earth against his will. Between Tarnsman and Outlaw. It is presumed Tarl would have received the Serums when brought to Gor the first time.
snowrose{JTr}'s pleasure~GS~fg 20:30:29 pm CST
Thank You Mistress...she will read it later
Dak 20:30:48 pm CST
it seems to Me, that Ubar Luther s making up a lot of things I've never read in the books!
Lita, Physician 20:33:46 pm CST
WEll Dak, I have never found any quotes which contradict anything Luther has said, and while he doesn't ALWAYS back everything up with quotes, he often does. All I know is he knows the books even better than I do.
Dak 20:36:35 pm CST
that's possible, *smiles*, but some things I'm sure I would remember, *smiles* I read slow and every word !
Dak 20:37:44 pm CST
I think the books leave a lot to the individual reader's imagination , *smiles*
snowrose{JTr}'s pleasure~GS~fg 20:38:12 pm CST
snow must say it all kind of blurs together in her head
Dak 20:41:05 pm CST
well, this suddenly ended, this night, I will call the Forum to a close, *smiles*,
thanks for scribing snowrose
snowrose{JTr}'s pleasure~GS~fg 20:41:55 pm CST
Thank You for leading Master Dak...she hopes to see You soon