The SKULLSPLITTER: Before we begin, I would like to point out that if you are not already aware, the Council has discussed last weeks Forum vote regarding collar tags for members. To encourage GS Board use, if you are not aware of the vote, I suggest you read the Council decisions which can be found here:
http://goreanshores.conforums.com/index.cgi
The SKULLSPLITTER: Laroona would you like to comment before we start?
FORUMS SCRIBES WORK
Laroona: Thank you Captain Thorfinn
This I hope is a gentle reminder for all and not a shot at any *S*
How the scribes work at Forums:
At the conclusion of a forum the following comments were made indicating the frustration of the scribes:
“ jessenia{Rm}~t.. jesse keeps thinking one day she'll perhaps post in detail what all goes into scribing... just to give some food for thought
Laroona: jessenia I am thinking that myself I did post it on one forum I may repost it again *S*”
The scribes who are cutting and pasting (C&P) save every post pertaining to the topic under discussion in order of posting as much as they possible can and place the posts into a word document. The end document ranges on average of between 20 to 30 pages weekly.
They sit and do this or the entire forum. The concentration level required for the entire forum is extremely high, so much so that and rarely get time to participate, or even have a break.
The interruptions of cross talk: examples:- people posting entering and greeting; people posting leaving; actions posts such as kissing a slave; pulling slave onto laps; etc : these require removing from among the discussion posts.
The Forum protocols are on the website for all to see. http://www.angelfire.com/vt/goreanshores/gsinfo/forumprotocols.html
It should not be up to scribes or any moderator to have to ask that people keep greetings; cross talk etc to whispers, stated at the commencement of every forum and a reminder is posted at the conclusion of the notes after being posted on the website. Every week the requests go unheeded and are ignored.
After they have done that work they then forward the notes to the website scribes for checking and formatting before uploading to the site. That takes another hour or more of a scribes RT time to do.
The end result of ignoring the requests to keep greetings etc to whispers during the past few forums could end up with no scribes, due to burn out, and sheer frustration.
If people want to continue to be able to read the notes then this behaviour needs to be curbed. It begins with common courtesy and respect to another person doing work for the betterment of GS.
SLAVES URTED
The SKULLSPLITTER: First topic:
What to do when a slave gets "urted" from a room or during a serve and is unable to return. Not to offend those Free present, what is she to do when it happens?
blossom~urt: best thing to do is post an apology on the boards....seems to have been the protocol most places over the years...not sure what policy is in GS though
Jake: beg for mercy when next she sees the Free?
Laroona: that is the usual thing it is not the slaves fault if the ISP or server goes down
OriginalSandman: in my opinion the slave apologizes to the Free at the earliest possibility if there is no chance to do it in person within a day or sa, leave a message on the boards RT issues and computer issues are going to happen.. no need to beat up a slave who is ...Honestly... having a problem
Laroona: seeing the Free concerned could be a hand away at times
why a post on the boards indicated IMO the girl had a RT issue rather than I do not want to serve issue
blossom~urt: course if it is a usual occurrence, say, when being dealt punishment or just decide to "disappear" if certain people enter or something of the ilk, then that should be dealt with too. it's not an excuse to just close to browser and blame the ip
Jake: what if the role was reversed..and the slave slighted?
Laroona: good point Jake never see a free apologize to a slave when urted
what many forget is Free or slave we are all ppl behind the screens
The SKULLSPLITTER; Ok let's focus on the first aspect, of the topic, and THEN discuss the second part of it. All in agreement then that the slave is to apologize as early as possible, there is NOTHING anyone can do about a server or ISP issue, and if that person is not around to apologize to, a simple message on the Boards will suffice.
Aye?
Jake: if she pours her heart and soul out and say Us midwesterners have a storm kick up..I may not be able to wait to say I need to go..so I try and explain when next seen
Ulrich: aye JT that is reasonable, and has generally been the accepted protocol in the past
Nerius Magnhild: nods in agreement
Laroona: that is the norm and only when slave is able to post at her earliest
often servers can be down for hours...
blossom~urt: a slave should apologize publicly just because it shows true regret but perhaps a Free could private message or email the slave thereby remembering the girl behind the screen but not calling into question the true Master/slave relationship that we come here to role-play. In the gorean realm, a free would not be found apologizing to a slave because he had to rush out of a paga tavern to do something
Jake: Aye it would seem fair
Laroona: or bad weather interferes so I would say yes with stipulation at her earliest time back online
The SKULLSPLITTER: Remember, if the site goes down, chances are, the Person being served is not going to be able to get back on so am sure they would understand... the server does not pick and choose which members to crash upon though it has been noted at times to crash on "Locations".
2nd part, the roles reversed, if the Free vanishes mid serve... slaves often put in hard work into their serves so it is understandable that they will get peeved off and deterred from returning if such keeps happening. What I want is to remind the people of GS that we are a COMMUNITY, only as strong as the next member. It is common courtesy to regard all people with that respect, and generally, if there are issues where Pledged Members are disrupting that community deliberately, we want to hear about it at the council. If those people generally do not care about the inner workings of GS, or do nothing at all, then it is not an issue for Me to discuss removing the bad roots.
If people OUTSIDE of GS are acting in this manner, then I suggest the slave simply do as she should - be a slave - deal with it, and again notify us so we know to keep an eye on those visiting should they wish to Pledge later. We do NOT need to accept any old willy nilly for member numbers or activity purposes.
Jake: agreed
OriginalSandman: nodding to Thorfinn seems reasonable
Ulrich: well said JT
Karima: ~Nodding in agreement~ Aye, a fair point.
The SKULLSPLITTER: Would anyone like to add or suggest anything to that?
Deirdre~Physician & Sandman's Woman: Pretty much is up to common sense, Captain.....as You stated so well. *shrugging* Take each incident as it happens.....and use common sense....and treat others as You wish to be treated.
FREE ENTERING KENNELS
The SKULLSPLITTER: 2nd Topic:
Regarding "male" slaves entering the Kennels. How can a slave ask them to leave when it is unknown if they are a GS member or not?
blossom~urt: wouldn't they have a collar if they were a GS slave?
Laroona: male slaves or male free? more often I see male Free in the kennels
a slave has a right to be there
Jake : exactly..no collar and why are they there?
Jake: though thralls a rarity about here unless changed..I would think he would be known?
The SKULLSPLITTER: Apologies, I misread the Topic.
~Chuckles~
Male FREE! Not male slave.
Laroona: the same reason often uncollared females go to the kennels
mostly to learn before taking a collar that is what I have found to be
The SKULLSPLITTER Trying that again - 2nd Topic:
Regarding Free Males entering the Kennels. How can a slave ask them to leave when it is unknown if they are a GS member or not?
Jake: Free are NOT allowed in kennels...unless the Slaver
Laroona: LOL slaves have been instructed to politely ask the person to leave if they do not C &P it all to Captains showing they have placed the person on ignore
OriginalSandman: as far as Male Free,, the slaves need to be asked to leave if they are new,, or if not the slaves all put him on iggy
Ulrich: I've seen a couple of instances of this. I will pop into the Kennels if I see a Free in there, but so far, the slaves have politely informed them that it is an area for slaves only, and Free should not be in there.
Karima: ~Drools at the thought of male slaves, then wakes from Her slumber, knowing twas only a dream~ Back to reality. I understand that members are listed on the angelfire website, so it would seem quite easy to find out Who is a member, and who is not.
blossom~urt: blossom would just greet them politely, then offer to follow them to the tavern where they may serve as Free are not allowed to enter the kennels. If it is slave class, then offer to follow in a certain amount of time when the class is over
Laroona: another option if they are new slaves can also point them to the Tavern and offer a serve never know if that is going to be a new GS Free... *S*
Laroona: it is clear at the entry (many do not read) kennels are slaves only... or Captains
Ulrich: Member or not, Free are not allowed in the kennels.
Their status of their membership only helps determine whether they should know better or not.
The SKULLSPLITTER ~Nods hearing the responses~
A reminder from the web site where the rules are posted:
Slave Kennels
At no time are any free permitted to enter the kennels the exceptions are Council Members or a Free who has the express consent from Council to enter.
------
This has also been discussed before, and it was also decided that the slave politely ask them to leave (Perhaps direct them to the website for rules), C&P to the Council if a problem arises.
The SKULLSPLITTER: Yes Karima, a good point. The slaves should pretty much be able to remember the names of GS Members, or even refer to the list if in doubt.
Jake: may go to show a genuine lack of true interest if the home page not read nor heeded to..pledged or not
Laroona: heck these are rules all Pledged patrons should know...
and I cannot see why a pledged patron could not enter and shoo one out
if they are being a problem or a HNG
Deirdre~Physician & Sandman's Woman: If it is a new GS Patron, and They don't know the rules, I'm sure a gentle reminder is enough to suffice.
Laroona: if newly pledged they should know the rules and protocols first IMO s
so the situation of a pledge entering, (Unless with council approval) should not arise
aurora{Ulrich}-t: Master Xertog has informed the slaves to copy and paste if necessary for non members, obtain their ISP through the 'source' if necessary
ask the Free to leave, if He does not oblige to take the meeting or discussion to a private room inform the Captains
Ulrich: Again, it's something to be handled on a case to case basis. It's possible someone new may enter without reading, and truly have no ill intent.
The few times I've seen someone enter, a polite request from the slaves requesting the person leave with an explanation has been sufficient.
The SKULLSPLITTER: Well as of the last time we discussed a few things regarding Pledging Members, the Council has pretty much agreed to doing a basic Orientation test on new members (Including room rules) so they will have no excuses so it should not happen again (With those pledging from now onward for example).
Again, on topic, remind them, or inform them, politely ask to leave, if a problem occurs, C&P to council and we deal with it. Though I'd be interested to hear if they DO leave anyway, just to see how many times they reoffend.
aurora{Ulrich}-t: its been this girl's experience that most Free do leave when asked to and always the offer made to serve when class is finished
The SKULLSPLITTER: There you go, aurora has the full information there.
Anything to add?
PAYMENT FOR SERVES
The SKULLSPLITTER: I'll take that as a no then.
Topic 3:
Some Free are not paying for food, drinks, use of slaves which raises the question...
How do slaves ask for payment of services?
Deirdre~Physician & Sandman's Woman: I think that I may be guilty of that sometimes. I am use to Sandman taking care of the payment and when He isn't there, I forget. I, for One, would appreciate a gentle reminder in a PM that I need to pay. I wouldn't be offended at all. That IS what should happen, I think.
Jake Honest:..I have never seen a girl ask..only Men offer
Jake: Those that know to
Karima: ~Looks to the Lady~ Aye, I would agree on that, Deirdre. Tis a courtesy to whisper a request for payment in such a circumstance. It should free the slave of guilt at having to ask for payment, and also the guilt for the Free that has forgotten.
Laroona: but would that not be a slave ordering a Free?
I recall Captain Rollo at one other forum stating along the lines
"GS is not a charity"
the only pppl I know or understand not paying are Council member and Captain Emeritis.
the only drink that is free is water.
OriginalSandman: I have seen a more experienced slave prod a new Master.. maybe once or twice.. shrugging there are always whispers of course
Karima: Laroona, is not payment for a service the "norm" in Gor?
Laroona: I believe the general rule of thumb is a girl comes with the price of paga
but again I think it comes down to Free being blaize and take everything for granted
Deirdre~Physician & Sandman's Woman I would not see that as a slave "ordering" Me to pay. If it is done respectfully and in whispers there would be no reason to see it as such. I mean......it is still up to Me to pay or not to. *shrugging*
blossom~urt: what if the slave, when offering to serve, says something like "we have paga or mead for one tarsk"
Laroona: blossom well said a very good idea the menu does have the prices listed
aurora{Ulrich}-t: a girl can be subtle add it to the end of her serve or before the Master releases her she hesitated before rising before Him her gaze lifting for an ihn hoping the Master would not forget His coin for the food/drink she was honored to serve Him
The SKULLSPLITTER: Well, you have the option of whispers, which would be fine, if the slave was given permission to whisper to the Master of course...
~Grins~
But then we have a Price menu, a link to it can be found on the web site. The slave could simply ask if there would be anything else he wanted from that menu and inform him of how much their paga, or whatever costs. she does not need to suggest he pay, but surely a dimwit would realize he has to pay after that. He may not choose to pay until he leaves, however, so it may offend, so perhaps the best way is to ask permission to whisper, and then "inform" politely.
Laroona: unfortunately if one clicks on the menu link in the rooms it takes one out..
maybe GaryM can have it linked to open in another window (I can mail him that later)
The SKULLSPLITTER: Combining both blossom and aurora's idea's is also a very viable option.
Laroona: I at times have dug into my coin purse and paid especially if the patron is regular as a hint hint hint LOL
Jake: nods..unless the dimwit was in the kennels first and asked to leave them?
shuts up
nara {GS}~t: First... nara believes it is all in the way that a slave carries herself. If her actions are respectful, and subtle, not demanding, or pointing something out to be rude, or just to get attention, nara cannot foresee any problem happening
Second: In response to the opening in the same window, and taking One out of chat, there is always the option of right clicking "tavern menu" selecting "open in new window" and that is not longer an issue
The SKULLSPLITTER: Ok so basically, the options are: Whisper and politely inform. Include it subtlety into the serve. Include the price when offering to serve.
Offer the Menu.
If all of that fails, we will simply lock them in a cage until the Green Caste invent Brain transplants. A Jit Monkey will do for those I would think.
(Anymore topics btw send as we probably have time for one more)
Laroona: true nara but some are computer illerate so having it linked properly is a better option and not too difficult
Deirdre~Physician & Sandman's Woman: *laughing at the Northman's joke......a rarity that makes it even funnier*
Jake: chuckles..could not be helped
SITE ACTIVE SIGN?
The SKULLSPLITTER: Topic 4 (Rare this happens btw):
Should there be some sort of notice to visitors that the site is an active one, so that visitors don't drop by when it is empty and then assume the site is dead and never come back...
We almost lost the person that suggested this topic also because of the site being inactive when they first arrived, luckily, they chose to return.
Deirdre~Physician & Sandman's Woman: I think that maybe this won't be a problem any more, since there are echoes of people being in the site for a while after they are gone. Surely that will help people know that GS is active?
Laroona: hmmmm interesting topic one that would be difficult as many see the Where is if empty do not enter BUT there is the issue of ppl leaving yet names stay
nara {GS}~t: On that same place that They click to enter, our corks have a link as well. nara thinks if Someone was genuinely interested.... They would look into our corks, and see there are postings every day on top of that, a note that the site is currently active, could be just as easily looked over as an old note that is also outdated. We put a date with it, and it could change within a matter of weeks. nara just doesn't get the picture with that one
Jake: a suggestion then at the start up page..if active why not mention the Forums and classes and the readings of books and when?
Laroona: the corks are no listed in the site
nara {GS}~t: The are listed before you can enter the tavern...
Laroona: to have active site per say would need to be added by GaryM
The SKULLSPLITTER: I like the idea of links to the "BE IT KNOWN" Agreement page. I agree that a notice in the room itself would probably be overlooked. And yes, the backlog of text now remaining has probably helped keep a few.
So other than the suggestion by Jake, I don't see much else we can really do except try to make a bit of effort when we can. (I know I am guilty of this of late but then I am also a moody fucker of a Torvaldslander so it is safer for some if I stay out at times)
Laroona: nara not any more Gary has a thing about linking externally
Laroona: If some one can get GaryM to do that and make the rule for the market etc be a good idea
Laroona: the book readings are no longer due to lack of interest Xertog put a lot of effort into those for little return so he is no longer conducting them
nese 1: raises hand could someone leave like a reading or two on a board each week?
The SKULLSPLITTER: Aye, we had one or two for the Fight Nights, then nothing.
My rant about these things is, the Members HERE AT THE FORUM, suggest idea's, more idea's, complain about things, and so we discuss it, we change it to suit THEM and then the ones themselves who support the idea's do nothing to follow it up.
Again, to go back to an earlier statement about the GS COMMUNITY - we are only as strong as the next member. If you can be here, try to give just 10 minutes of your time and maybe someone else will give 10 minutes, and someone else, and someone else, and before you know it, those 10 minutes may become an hour, or two, or more if others appear.
Jake: touché
Laroona: well said Thorfinn well said
OriginalSandman: its true JT
Laroona: I think from memory a rant or pet peeve was a forum a couple of hands back I was not present but if memory serves me all of what Thorfinn said was said then too
galah{GS}: galah seconds that **bows her head with shame for being the most guilty of not being here** gal will try harder
The SKULLSPLITTER: So, back to topic, we can speak to Gary and try to get things linked. If that fails, there is nothing we can do except put a little time in ourselves to make ourselves be seen.
Laroona: PPl wanted a bio section I made it in my RT
I posted mine to give people an idea I see only 2 slaves have used it
Laroona: Thorfinn we can only try I know Xertog has so maybe more voices he will *S*
The SKULLSPLITTER: Aye Laroona, that is exactly one of the points, but, before we all turn into raging rabid foaming at the mouth monsters and tear shreds out of everything, let's take a moment to focus on nese's comment:
nese 1: raises hand could someone leave like a reading or two on a board each week?
Jake: I had a bio here long ago before the site was moved but not being a member I suppose it erased
Laroona: the books readings were discussions so people could have an understanding of them to post section could incur copyright issues... so I would be wary of that but there is nothing to stop ppl buying them I have a link where they can officially be purchased
Laroona Chroniles of Gor - the official John Norman site *S*
http://gorchronicles.com/modules/wfchannel/
Laroona ppl will need to add http:// in front that is how the site works not able to fully post links sorry
Jake : you can't post a quote and ask for ideas on the meaning without trouble if the quote is attributed to?
Jake: seems many do that as a signature to posts on the boards anyhow
Laroona: Jake not all bios were saved or from memory before the 50 megs site was pulled I will have to check if they are there still on a CD I will say that no one was deleted deliberately when making the new site.. it was not considered necessary to have them on the web site
I understand anyone can add a bio under the section *S*
The SKULLSPLITTER: Quotes are useless on their own Jake, this is why everyone thinks JN is a shit writer... the so called "contradictions". People forget that perceptions of peoples experience change and that the main character, TC is one of these that start off with one view, and through the years changes his view to a more Gorean one. If you look at some quotes from the characters view, some things change. They do not really contradict, they simply become more Gorean. Also in regards to quotes, sometimes you do not get the full story of the quote. What was said a page before, or a page after, may make more sense with the quote itself, or alter the perception of the quotes meaning.
nese 1: Can Masters have a theme of the week and tell slaves
The SKULLSPLITTER: nese, usually what is going to be discussed, is mentioned on the Boards.
Laroona: nese what slave classes are about often have themes but as Thorfinn said it is difficult to post quotes without a full picture *S*
Jake: nods Thorfinn..I do understand...
-§- kassi -§- : Perhaps the Captains and Gorean Shores girls could make a start on the bios...and Others will follow suit?
The SKULLSPLITTER: Perhaps kassi, I actually like others had one on the old site, in fact I think My main "story" is still on file somewhere, perhaps I will add it later.
Laroona: *slaps the typist ppl typos are fixed before uploading as some type fast and miss the correct spelling etc...
-§- kassi -§- : Jarl...Yours is still there, last i saw ~offers helpfully~
Laroona : I will look at my back up CD's and if I find any I will email to ppl as I am sure some things have altered over the years *S*
The SKULLSPLITTER: So basically nese, any future Book readings, the book and chapters are mentioned on the Boards of what is going to be discussed.
We cannot really post it all on the board due to copywrite so people will just have to get hold of the book, or have a summary of some kind made.
Does that help you?
nese 1: Yes Master that does help
The SKULLSPLITTER: Good, then as we have covered 5 topics in tonight’s forum, I would like to call it to a close so we can save some things for next time, unless anyone has any pressing business to discuss?
The SKULLSPLITTER: No problem Sandman, I was due My turn since I have been absent for many. Sorry if I pile drived through but I like to keep it short and sweet once a general agreement is made.
~Chuckles~
Laroona : Thank you Thorfinn for moderating
and I also thank you for allowing me to post the scribes thing
that made the forum so much easier *S*
najla thank you for scribing *S*