Present:
Thadron
Dak
Thorrn
Kazar
Bretval
Lita
marieve
karinda
thalia
giani
flicka
Dak 19:46:49 pm CDT
if any has a topic , whisper to Me and I will open the forum
Dak 19:51:29 pm CDT
ok I have a topic to discus,, I will open the Forum, same rules keep chit chat and greetings to whispers, .
we do have a scribe don't we ?
marieve*GS* 19:51:58 pm CDT
marieve will scribe Master Dak
Lita, Physician 19:53:36 pm CDT
I haven't heard from snow except for the one message, but I didn't really expect to.
Kazar~infamous pirate 19:53:43 pm CDT
Bretval ~`` he said fires were south of him ~`` but as helping out
Dak 19:54:14 pm CDT
very well, thanks marieve,
first topic
Style of Ownership
Quotes For This Week
"Even the gentlest and kindest of masters has absolute power over the slave. She is no less owned by him that she would be by the cruelest brute on Gor. Elated and reassured then is the woman that she is chained, in this finding continuing evidence of her master's desire for her, his passion for her, his prizing of her, his determination to keep her for himself. And for her part, she rejoices that she is helpless to escape him, that she truly belongs to him, that she is truly his, legally and otherwise, and that she must, as she intensely desires to do, continue to live for service and love. It is not merely pleasant to own a slave, to dress her as you please, if you to wish to permit her clothing, to have her at your bidding, to do with her as you please; it is exalting. The man who has not owned a slave has no conception of the maximums of sexuality, nor has the woman who has not been owned."
Renegades of Gor, pg 359
Questions
1)What does this quote say to you? 2)For the slaves, How would you respond to a more gentle style of owner?
3)For the free, do you feel you must always be harsh or controlling to maintain a sense of order
karinda {GS} 19:57:02 pm CDT
girl finds this quote to be as she is.....a slave and nothing more....even if a Master is gentle....He is always the one in command. girl does what she can to please Master girl hasn't been personally owned....but even the Captains all have a different style of command and punishment....AND reward. girl would just always be slave.....
Bretval, Merchant 19:58:54 pm CDT
It says to Me that it is possible to be as gentle, or as harsh, as the circumstances dictate.
thalia {GS} 19:59:10 pm CDT
well it means, to thalia anyways ,that even though each Master has different personalities and way He does things ,all slaves are the same and, no, thalia doesn't wish for a gentle owner that is if a slave could voice a choice in the matter
Jarl Thorrn enjoys roses 20:00:19 pm CDT
Not always being harsh and controlling but often a slave wants just this, to know and feel that she is slave and handled like a slave, making her feel her slavery deeply.
The right mixture of love and strength, of spoiling and spanking makes it, as i think *S*
Dak 20:00:31 pm CDT
even the kindest or gentlest of Masters will still expect obedience and perfection and exquisite beauty from a slave, and knows well how to get it from her !particularly if He feels a slave thinks they are able to work Him !
marieve*GS* 20:00:53 pm CDT
You welcomed, Master Dak.
it is a slave's fondest wish to find her true Master. One she can serve with all her heart and soul.
giani{GS} 20:01:22 pm CDT
girl has had it both ways and a combination of the 2 and she loved the combination or the two.. where she felt she could express herself without fear of being whipped but knew if she was displeasing to her Jarl at any time she would feel the kurt.. girl thrived on that..
Kazar~infamous pirate 20:02:02 pm CDT
fine line between too harsh and too gentle one needs to be both at times, time and place for all
thalia {GS} 20:03:33 pm CDT
nods in agreement hearing giani
Jarl Thorrn enjoys roses 20:06:14 pm CDT
Nods to Kazar
fine line .. that is how it is often in life
But slaves also must know and remember .... Gor isn´t supposed to be fair; they have to bear that too sometimes
Bretval, Merchant 20:07:31 pm CDT
if the slave is working her Master... then she can only expect the harshest punishment... no question about that
Dak 20:08:13 pm CDT
aye, if discipline is to lax, you end up with a Princess , instead of a slave !
flicka{Keeper} 20:08:28 pm CDT
~laughing sniffing a girl's armpits~ nope smelling as sweet as a summer's day
Kazar~infamous pirate 20:08:33 pm CDT
JAARL Thorn agreed have used my whip few times grins
Bretval, Merchant 20:11:15 pm CDT
to punish without cause is just bullying... and an indication that He is not all that sure of His own Mastery of the slave
Dak 20:12:07 pm CDT
a Gorean Master needs no reason to whip a slave !
thalia {GS} 20:13:30 pm CDT
shudders hearing of the whip
Bretval, Merchant 20:13:32 pm CDT
Exactly
Lita, Physician 20:14:07 pm CDT
Bretval that is true. However, especially sometimes at first, it is necessary to punish a slave to make her truly aware of her situation, and so that she knows that You can and will if necessary.
karinda {GS} 20:14:39 pm CDT
doesn't mind the whip. it is there to remind girl....girl's place.
Jarl Thorrn enjoys roses 20:14:48 pm CDT
Bretval
agreed when it is punishment for nothing because how to punish when the slave didn´t do anything wrong
But one can put a slave i harsh treatment or severe and strong discipline
e.g. to challenge her slavery, to make her go deeper into it and still accept it. Thus she can widen her experiences, find out where her limits may be and she still can bow her head and accept to be a slave
That can be hard and rough for her but it is no punishment, it is teaching and challenging her, developing her as a slave
thalia {GS} 20:16:43 pm CDT
listens quietly to Jarl Thorrn, blue eyes ever watchful
Jarl Thorrn enjoys roses 20:17:05 pm CDT
I think for the save it makes the difference if it is just harsh, rough or if it is meant as punishment A slave takes a lot when it comes from the Master but they can be weak to punishment and be desperate when they feel that she gets handled roughly because the Master is angry or discontent with her.
Wonders if the slaves will agree to this *S*
marieve*GS* 20:17:39 pm CDT
kajirae are whipped when they receive their collars. we have studied kiss the whip in slave class. that means that any whip of the Free can be lashed upon a kajiras back.
Bretval, Merchant 20:17:51 pm CDT
Granted, Lita... but that falls under the when and where... if the slave has not accepted her condition... then she must be punished until she learns
karinda {GS} 20:18:18 pm CDT
not sure Jarl Thorrn......karinda has never been personally owned. she hasn't had that scenario
flicka{Keeper} 20:18:48 pm CDT
sometimes the kiss of the whip for no reason reminds a slave of who and what she is, nothing, other than a creature of her Master's making. Sometimes a slave desiring to re-equate with this feeling will, in the absence of her Master using His whip judicially{SPP} will act a little bratty, princessy in order to to feel the touch of His whip. In this instance the slave is wrong because she has defeated her own purpose, that of being whipped for no reason at all.
Dak 20:20:33 pm CDT
I have found a number of ways to punish slaves, and seldom whip, but let them know it is always an option !
thalia {GS} 20:20:35 pm CDT
girl agrees Jarl Thorrn to a point
Kazar~infamous pirate 20:21:33 pm CDT
Dak sometimes the threat is worse than the act helps them toe the line better
Jarl Thorrn enjoys roses 20:22:24 pm CDT
I prefer to use the whip and such to teach a slave, even when she failed it should first be teaching her to become a better slave, to see and understand why she wronged and how to avoid it.
Using a punishment is an cruel thing, not a teaching and developing thing though the same methods and tools can be used in it. The difference is the state if mind and intentions with which they are done. For those differences the slaves have a fine sensibility as i think.
Bretval, Merchant 20:22:36 pm CDT
Again Thorn. there is a reason, a purpose... to punish for NO reason is just being a bully in My mind... because You can is no reason to do so..*g* unless the slut really enjoys being punished for nothing
marieve*GS* 20:23:18 pm CDT
aye Jarl Thorrn. a whipping is sometimes a consequence of actions done by the slave. the disapproval of the Free, hurts far more.
thalia {GS} 20:23:44 pm CDT
nods to marieve
flicka{Keeper} 20:24:36 pm CDT
~listening to Master Bretval, agreeing with Him about reasons sometimes being not obvious.~
karinda {GS} 20:25:20 pm CDT
the worse punishment girl got here was to be tied to a post...whipped and left for the Free to taunt girl. the whip hurt....but the taunting was humiliating. she learned the most from that punishment. proves the whip isn't always what punishes the slave the best
karinda {GS} 20:25:45 pm CDT
nods in agreement with marieve
thalia {GS} 20:26:33 pm CDT
or being cuffed, karinda, that's just as bad in thalia's opinion
karinda {GS} 20:27:24 pm CDT
winces and nods to the cuffs
thalia {GS} 20:28:17 pm CDT
head raises a bit, looks around, hoping none of the Masters are taking notes
marieve*GS* 20:28:32 pm CDT
being caged is far worse than a whipping. a whipping is over in mere moments. one can reside in the cage for a fair amount of time then once released faces the whip as well
Jarl Thorrn enjoys roses 20:29:41 pm CDT
Bretval
I think i see your point
In what i differ is the use of the word punishment. To Me punishment has something about making a girl feel guilty, accusing her of being unruly or obnoxious and such, that the Master is angry about her.
Being rough to her, even whipping her for no reason can have a total different intention, to show her that she is property and she can be treated like property just because it pleases the Master to do so, not because He is angry but because He puts the slave under power, His power. And that is something slaves often enjoy to feel, to be slave and that the Master uses His power on her and they get put under control and the will of the Master
karinda {GS} 20:30:36 pm CDT
karinda has never been caged but it sounds awful
Jarl Thorrn enjoys roses 20:31:57 pm CDT
grins @ karinda ... and makes a note about her being caged *W*
karinda {GS} 20:32:58 pm CDT
shutters as eyes do not dare to gaze at Jarl Thorrn
Kazar~infamous pirate 20:33:09 pm CDT
m have to think of a reason too cage karinda lol
thalia {GS} 20:33:12 pm CDT
*shakes head* not really karinda, girl's heard both sides, some say it's not that bad some say it is *shrugs*
Jarl Thorrn enjoys roses 20:34:42 pm CDT
What about the opposite response, complementary of this?
A slave, as i know from many experiences, often enjoys to be put under strict power, even when she is no pain slut.
Don´t the Master also enjoy to put a slave under that strict control and power just because they are Master and enjoy to dominate a slave?
Just because they can
Bretval, Merchant 20:36:12 pm CDT
But again there is a purpose... if there is no reason then it may be the Masters own ego that is threatened...
Whispers 20:37:02 pm CDT
*slips in very quietly heading for the shadows...*
karinda {GS} 20:37:23 pm CDT
lifts emerald eyes gazing at Master Bretval
marieve*GS* 20:38:06 pm CDT
aye Jarl. being bound by Master's will would be difficult
Jarl Thorrn enjoys roses 20:38:44 pm CDT
There is a purpose, Bretval
The same purpose why slaves want to be slaves and need to be slaves, it is in them and they enjoy it
The same for a Master, He enjoys to dominate a slave and let her feel to be dominated by Him. They ways the Two enjoy can be very different and they can be very joyful for both *smiles*
Dak 20:38:52 pm CDT
I think few Masters punish without reason, but that is not saying they can't either
Kazar~infamous pirate 20:40:47 pm CDT
Bretval always about ego `~ one can be harsh without use of force~`~ ~how one says it ``` not what you say ~
karinda {GS} 20:42:14 pm CDT
heart drops....seeing the Slave Master come in...smiles knowing He is ok
Whispers 20:42:39 pm CDT
*stays in her shadowy corner.. feeling His presence immensely... *
flicka{Keeper} 20:43:21 pm CDT
~Hears Jarl Keeper return with the wood ladened trailer, slips out to help Him un-stack it.~
Jarl Thorrn enjoys roses 20:43:40 pm CDT
Tal Captain
Fine to see You being in
Dak
I point to the difference of punishment, which included for Me to be angry at a slave and let her feel being angry at her, and just being rough to her, even when this means whipping her. The later is normal slave fate, the first hurts her soul
Lita, Physician 20:44:00 pm CDT
Tal Thadron
Bretval, Merchant 20:44:01 pm CDT
Of course they can, Dak, the only question is when they should... but as pointed out earlier every Master
Kazar~infamous pirate 20:44:08 pm CDT
Tal Captain Thadron as His own style
Jarl Thorrn enjoys roses 20:44:38 pm CDT
For me it is the difference between being cruel and being rough
marieve*GS* 20:44:58 pm CDT
glancing up from the scrolls as the Slave Master enters
Bretval, Merchant 20:45:23 pm CDT
That is true, Thorrn
Thadron - Captain/Slave Master 20:46:19 pm CDT
sits quietly in My chair for only a few ehns
Dak 20:46:52 pm CDT
aye, that they do, *smiles*, Bretval
.. Thadron - Captain/Slave Master 20:53:50 pm CDT
Is Forum winding down?...
I didn't mean to bring it to a halt...
as I've told you, I can't stay tonight, thank you all for being faithful to the home and coming in tonight... I hope to be here for book club on Tuesday...
otherwise I have to go prepare some dinner for some friends...
I wish everyone well
Kazar~infamous pirate 20:54:46 pm CDT
Thadron r/t always comes first hope fires all put out now ~
Dak 20:54:52 pm CDT
I wish You well Captain and good luck
Lita, Physician 20:55:12 pm CDT
Our thoughts are all with You and Yours, Thadron
marieve*GS* 20:55:14 pm CDT
girl wishes You well, Master Thadron
Thadron - Captain/Slave Master 20:56:08 pm CDT
steps quietly out...
Jarl Thorrn enjoys roses 20:56:35 pm CDT
Be well captain and thanks that You let Us know how You are Be well and make it safely through the rough times
Dak 20:57:02 pm CDT
is there anymore discussion on this topic ? *smiles*
Jarl Thorrn enjoys roses 20:58:25 pm CDT
damn, too late
again a fast Captain´s exit
*L*
thalia {GS} 20:59:19 pm CDT
wonders if Master Thadron was wearing roller skates since His exit was so fast? *laughs
Dak 21:00:39 pm CDT
He has pressing obligation elsewhere, just came in to let everyone know He was doing fine
Lita, Physician 21:00:40 pm CDT
Alas, time for Me to go. Rounds begin early tomorrow.
karinda {GS} 21:01:15 pm CDT
giggles at thalia....funny
Lita, Physician 21:01:21 pm CDT
I wish All well, enough, and great joy
Dak 21:01:25 pm CDT
if that is all for this Forum, I will call it closed !
karinda {GS} 21:02:03 pm CDT
thank You, Master Dak for leading forum
thank you. pretty marieve for scribing